I think I've correctly ID'd this as a Conrad per a 1930s ad in the database. The strange thing is the movement has no date symbol. There's no date code anywhere on the watch. I've never seen one like this and don't know what to make of it.
The movement is 10AN, 21 jewel. The case serial number is 1168654. The case reads, "Bulova Quality, PAT. JAN .11, 1927". The case is hinged, and the dust cover is intact.
The case is great shape, but the dial needs refinishing, and the second hand is missing. It really needs all new hands. The crystal looks like someone attacked it with a wire brush.
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In reply to Very nice.... love that case by plainsmen
Thanks! I'm venturing into new territory here. Usually, I buy watches that have already been refinished. But very recently I've started looking out for hidden gems that just need a little TLC to bring them back to life. I think it's going to be hugely satisfying to see them pretty up. Now, if I could just figure out how one finds all the parts that need to be replaced, and who does the best dial refinishing (without spending a fortune). I've still got so much to learn.
In reply to Thanks! I'm venturing into by NOVA
This is how I sort of do it... probably because I don't want to pay the finished product pricing! haha... cheapy..
The staple of dial refinishing is International Dial.... as far as the parts go... I just send my stuff to Mike at Timemachines... he's very reasonable and cool to work/talk with. It's up to you... find someone you get along with and let them do the expertise part. Even when you have a guy like him do it.... your still going to come out with a KNOWN..... you know it's just been cleaning/serviced... and you KNOW the works done how you want it.
When you buy something already done... you have to take it at the sellers word... who really knows how it's been done.
I do quite a bit of the cleaning/cosmetic stuff myself... takes a little time and patience but it's really fun bringing something rough to buff!
Hey Nova,
Do you perhaps have a way to measure the crystal proportions in mm? I have two "Conrad" models ID'd to date... however not the first, which indeed appears to be the model you scored :-) (Great find, BTW!)
Your best bet to measure crystals, is to remove the old one and (aside from a "case back opener") get "digital calipers" on eBay for around $15.00 (if you don't already have them?) since crystals are calibrated within 1/100 of a millimeter! That being said, one can often ID the correct fit from the 20s and 30s with .5mm accuracy... as the glass+ was generally flat around the outer perimeter, and there were far fewer designs in general to contend with back then, from most manufacturers...
Kind regards :-)
Scott
Scott,
Thanks for your interest in helping me out with this one. I do have digital calipers and did remove the crystal. Here's how it measures: 21.80 mm in length; 15.80 mm in widthm, 1.8 mm in depth. Those are approximates, since the slightest movement of the crystal changes the measurement. It has a very slight curve in all directions.
As for the absence of a date code, should I be concerned about that? I've looked and looked, and there really isn't one. Is that unusual? Does it hurt the value? Is my only way of dating the watch the ad from 1930?
Thanks much,
Lisa
In reply to Scott, Thanks for your by NOVA
Hi Lisa,
Off hand I see no (name) mention of this specific (nor any other) model taking those precise proportions... However, I do have (5) BB and Fulton glass here, measuring:
BB: X2198 x 157. (Rectangular, 21.98mm x 15.7mm) and is the same in Fulton, except they did "fudge" the hundreths slightly +/- , to keep their parts inventories in line... :-)
Fulton : "3-219B x 159" is the same fit as the BB above, for instance... And BB and Perfit are nearly always 1/100mm wider/narrower by number... even though they are the same fit, typically! So I suspect BB reads: "157, PF: 158 and FTN: 159" in width...)
The same holds true with lengths as well, of course! And a longer glass may well be the added CURVATURE, particularly on the newer (i.e. 50s+) molded crystal designs. (Made to keep watchmakers buying more crystal stock to {psych} "update" the appearance of the older models!)
If you need a new crystal, I suggest either sending the old one for a precise (or very close) match? Or perhaps considering sourcing the above fit, to see if it either fits "as is..." or can simply be resized (i.e. downsized) to fit, by shaving a hair off the length?? I'd venture to say there's nearly a 50% chance this is indeed the correct fit, since Bulova often reused the same bezel opening specs, even on very different cases, time and again. And if it's 1/10mm longer... that can be shaved off in minutes, by a good/properly equiped, watchmaker...
A Class Act Design! Art Deco has always been my favorite design style, Post Neo Classical :-)
Do you have the "Conrad," yet? I just got one in today... (1940s varietal.) It's an elegant case design in pink (rose) gold with a copper dial... has flexible lugs and is a good size and understatedly slylish look for the ladies, I think???
PM or email for more info., to source glass, or get my addy to send the old glass to...
My Best :-) Scott
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Hi Nova,
I've found on several watches the 1930 date stamp very faint and the traces only found under 10x's magnifacation. Plains is right on about re-dialing, Int'l Dial is the best one out there for the money. I've been doing business with them for 8-9 years now.
Parts are a different issue, you will need to find a watchmaker, not a jeweller but a watchmaker in your area or someone here on the sight willing to take on your work. Finding exactly what you might need is best left to those who do restorations.
Good luck!
The Date stamp is usually always found on a section of the movement that can't be removed.Several with invisible Date codes but that sure looks like an X in the highlighted area, not a very clean one granted..
IMO I wouldn't refinish the Dial on this one either, from the photgraph the Dial looks presentable and to a Collector an original Dial is always preferable.
I think I found it. Wiped away more tarnish and found what looks to be a very small circle. It's the only mark I can find that looks deliberate. In the picture above you can see it to the left of the middle jewel. It looks a little more distinct after wiping the area, but not much. That puts the watch at 1934.
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