What do we have here?

Submitted by plainsmen on July 31, 2011 - 11:20pm

Just snagged a nice little set from the bay...

cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll

Two of the three give me a nice little excited feeling...  I'll get a bit more info when I get the package but...

What do we think?.... a black dialed clipper and maybe a LE IV?

  

 

plainsmen
Posted July 31, 2011 - 11:44pm

Oh hey.... could have found them both on this 1937 Ad....

Definately looks like the American Clipper "C"... and maybe the Crockett?

www.mybulova.com/sites/default/files/vintage_ads/bulova-ad-1937-4.jpg

Hrmm..... oh yeah brothers... take a look at the 1935 LEIV shown below

www.mybulova.com/sites/default/files/vintage_ads/Bulova_1933_Ad12.jpg

The bezel is definately super rectangular with no diamond type curvature at all... while that pictured watch above definately has that.... yep I'm thinking Clipper C and the Crockett.....

GVP
Posted August 1, 2011 - 7:19am

 Well jerin you've taught me something new today. I have had so many of the "crocket" and always thought they were Clipper models.  Great stuff. I agree with your diagnosis....

plainsmen
Posted August 1, 2011 - 8:27am

Schweet!

Elgin Doug
Posted August 1, 2011 - 12:37pm

I hate to say this, but that 'Clipper' doesn't look right to me.  The steps are too smothed down, the lugs are too long.  Compare to mine

But the right-hand case looks like the engraved Clipper case (Clipper B?) to me.

Also, the pics of the Crockett show the engraving ending where the crystal ends, not extending down the lugs.

What if the two movements/dials were switched?  The dial on the left is not really a great fit to the case - the minute track gaps at the midpoint, and at the ends.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 1, 2011 - 2:58pm

ruh roh

Not a 'CLIPPER', the case is incorrect as stated above.

Elgin Doug
Posted August 1, 2011 - 6:57pm

I'd argue that the one on the right is a Clipper case, though.  And the one on the left is a Clipper dial.  The one on the right looks like a Ben Hur dial.

mybulova_admin
Posted August 1, 2011 - 7:20pm

Here is the ad Jerin is referring to above.

Buliova Clipper C and Crockett

 

GVP
Posted August 2, 2011 - 8:54am

 Hut Dang people its another can of worms.  Doug is right about the engraving and clipper C, perhaps Iwas right at first.......and yes the lugs on the first watch look way to long compared to a clipper.  

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 2, 2011 - 9:07am

The Case of the Watch on the left is not even close to being that of a 'CLIPPER'.

OldTicker
Posted August 2, 2011 - 10:00am

Engraved watch on right American Clipper "F"

Watch on left ???

GVP
Posted August 2, 2011 - 10:04am

 except for the dial yes, which should be pointed. mash up of watches maybe?

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 2, 2011 - 12:51pm

In reply to by GVP

I'd say GJ.

If You look closely at the Dial on the right (besides the numerals being wrong for a 'CLIPPER') the Seconds track has a smooth radius curve from top to bottom - wrong Dial for that Case.

The Dial of the Watch on the Left with it's angular seconds track is more fitting to the Case on the Right.

OldTicker
Posted August 2, 2011 - 9:03pm

In reply to by GVP

Yes, it looks like the dial is wrong for the case, or the crystal is distorting it. I'm sure Plains will let us know when he gets it. ; )

Elgin Doug
Posted August 2, 2011 - 12:02pm

Has anyone ever seen the black Clipper C dial with the engraved Clipper F case?

plainsmen
Posted August 5, 2011 - 8:43am

Hrmm.. got the watches yesterday.  The blackdial "clipper" looks to be a recase.  Pretty decent tip off with the engraving on the side of the case I've never seen before. 

The white dialed clipper looks pretty legit.

bourg01
Posted August 5, 2011 - 4:02pm

Hey Jerin,

Sorry I missed all the fun! I was going to say check for a re-case. I have however seen the black dial in a American Clipper "C" though I don't re-call the date on the AD, 1939....I think. The C is not engraved on the bezel and neither is the B with the white dial.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 5, 2011 - 4:35pm

The White Dial is incorrect for a 'CLIPPER' - as just about everyone has mentioned.

The Black Dial is more consistant with a 'CLIPPER' but belongs in the Watch Case on the right as the Case on the left  is not a 'CLIPPER'.

                          Left                                                                                                               Right

plainsmen
Posted August 5, 2011 - 7:12pm

So why is the watch on the right not the Crocket?

mybulova_admin
Posted August 5, 2011 - 7:41pm

Certainly looks like one to me.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 6, 2011 - 12:37pm

The engraving pattern of the Watch bezel on the right is 'CLIPPER' and the smooth arc to the Seconds track on the Dial does not match the angular lines of the Case.

shooter144
Posted August 6, 2011 - 2:28pm

In reply to by FifthAvenueRes…

Im not following you here Fifth, the secs track is barrel shaped as the case is...how should it be???? I dont know , not doubting just do not understand what u mean.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 7, 2011 - 7:19am

Shooter,

My bad, I meant to say Minutes track, sorry for the confusion.

Note how it dips under the Bezel at 2, 4, 8 and 10.

The Case is from a 'CLIPPER', the Dial is not.

'CROCKETT' above:

At no time does the Minutes track approach the bezel edge, this space is even all the way around.

As GJ mentioned earlier it may be the current owner mis-matched the bezels, I would try swapping the Black Dialed movement on the left into the Case Bezel on the right.

Class dismissed.

plainsmen
Posted August 7, 2011 - 9:37am

That's an artists drawing Mark.  What a goofball.... heh.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 8, 2011 - 8:24am

Brilliant deduction Einstein!  or did the kids help with that one?

Show Me a Watch on which the Minutes track does not follow the Case bezel lines and I'll show You a Watch with the wrong Dial.

mybulova_admin
Posted August 8, 2011 - 9:29pm

In reply to by FifthAvenueRes…

I guess that Bulova re-dialed their advert on the American Clipper "C" as the minute tracks certainly don't follow the case bezel lines. I take your point Fifth, but I don't think its a hard and fast rule.

Plains watch dial track certainly does look curved as opposed to angled.

mybulova_admin
Posted August 8, 2011 - 8:36am

Plains, how many jewels does the white dial  watch have?

That may help shed some light also.

FifthAvenueRes…
Posted August 8, 2011 - 10:14pm

The White Dial does appear to be 'BEN HUR' or 'CROCKETT' style admin, but the Case bezel is 'AMERICAN CLIPPER'.

Note the smooth arch to the Bezels' verticle edges and slight lug variation shown on the 2 examples of the 'BEN HUR' above in comparison to the distict 'V' shape of the 'AMERICAN CLIPPER' below.

* I still strongly suggest the Bezel of the Watch on the Right in the original post belongs with the Dial on the Left.

OldTicker
Posted August 8, 2011 - 11:36pm

Hey Plains,

Did you try swapping the movements, maybe the seller got confused and put them together wrong...Black dial engraved Clipper "D"?!!  ; O

mybulova_admin
Posted August 9, 2011 - 1:18am

Yeah go the swap Plains.

plainsmen
Posted August 9, 2011 - 7:15am

Yeah... now that Greg and Steve say it it makes sense.  I wasn't going to do it out of principle cause of the dickish nature in which Mark brought it up.... but now that it's you guys.... well SURE!  Hahah....

Elgin Doug
Posted August 9, 2011 - 3:05pm

Well, heck - i told you to switch them back on the 1st of August!  What am I, chopped liver? ;-)

plainsmen
Posted August 9, 2011 - 9:42pm

True true My Douglas.... Props!