Hello all,
I picked up this automatic beauty not to long ago. Here is what I know:
[quote]Bulova 11ALACD
Features
automatic
sweep second
date: set by changing 22:15-24h
Data
11.5''', Dm= 25.6mm
H= 5.9mm
17/23 jewels
f = 18000 A/h
power reserve 42h
Balance staff U3319
Stem W2802[/quote]
Courtesy of: www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi
What I don't know is what model this is. It is a beautiful watch, and has only been off of my wrist when I sleep. I hope you all are able to help out.
Much better pictures of the movement:
It bears a strong resemblance to a 1965 Date King.
http://www.mybulova.com/watches/1965-date-king-1272
The case is silver whereas the Date King is gold.
I have also read threads where this has been called a President. I am not sure which is which now.
Anyone have any Ideas?
In reply to 'DATE KING' IMO by FifthAvenueRes…
Alright, if you're going to make me play, I will. But my most valuable input will remain that Fifth should do us all the favor of supporting his opinions. Where's the ad? Other watches in the database? Something besides a mere opinion?
I don't spend much time studying the late models, but a quick glance at the ads shows this 1964 President "O", which seems to share quite a few features with the subject watch.
I've seen the discussions about those ads, whether it is a typo or actually a president. If the President line was only offered with 30J movements (and the red ad is a typo), and the Date King with 17, then I would imagine that, unless this is not an original movement, this would be a Date King. Just my take. I can not say for certain that Presidents were only offered with 30J, and the DK only 17J ( as I am still new into the world of older watches). The only thing that makes me want to say President is the fact that in the second ad, model labeled B is silver (or in this case the stay-bright stainless) and this watch is indeed silver/stainless. Please, correct me if I am wrong.
In reply to I've seen the discussions by Marty0341
You're correct, and B and E in the ad are not noted as to having 30J movements.
a secondary ad Dated 1964 mentions 39 Calendar styles, with no mention of the 'PRESIDENT'
it had been past practice for Bulova to keep the Jewel count the same across the different models, this one is making Me think.
I highly doubt there was a 17 Jewel 'PRESIDENT' in the 1960's, but I've been wrong before...
You guys aren't making this any easier!
Ticker - I can see the prices that you were talking about. Perhaps they did have different lines of the President that came with different J counts. Perhaps this is a President (B?)
Fifth - I wonder if this is one of those 39. I guess we will just havet to come to a general consensus about what type this is? But please, keep the information coming!! This has turned out to be quite an intriguing mystery.
The more the convoluted the history is of this watch the more fascinated that I become with it. I am glad to find out that they call the face "snow drift" as this is the most visually appealing faces I have on any of my watches.
Fifth - Thank you for finding that stainless President! The only difference that I can see between your example and the ad, is that the ad does not show the "30 Jewels" on the face of the watch. While it is a possibility that the actual product may be different then advertised, perhaps not all of the Presidents that were stainless were 30J? Who knows, could be anything. I am still waiting to hear back from Bulova themselves.
Simple - I will add the movement to the database.
Muchas gracias Marty! Our movement data base is a critical part of our research but is often overlooked! Try to bear in mind we are trying to "restore" history for a company that was too stupid to realize how valuable their company records were (and I'm refering to the owners after Bulova sold out), so old ads and movements, along with old watch repair manuals etc are critical.
No problem Simple. It is unfortunate that the record keeping was not of high priority to Bulova. Perhaps Admin could talk to Roland Ranfft about adding his information for Bulova movements to the site? He has a lot of information on his website that I feel could only benefit ours. Just a thought.
In reply to No problem Simple. It is by Marty0341
Ranfft has a pretty cool online searchable database, gives production years by caliber, part numbers, interchangability and some specs which are useful but not extreemly helpful to naming models. It's another resource though...just to use from his interface but not add to mybulova.com. Regardless of content, it's like apples and oranges (or maybe avocadoes) to get stuff from one database into another. I think some members have most of this info in catalogs, manuals ect....but I sure don't, and I have used Ranfft site often.
Bulova got back to me today, so we now have confirmation as to which model this is. Here is the email response they sent me:
"In the 1967 catalog. I found your watch which has the following writeup its
a Date King TT white 17 jewels, stainless streel
waterproof, automatic, shock resistant, unbrakable mainspring, calendar,
sweep second hand, luminous dial and hands adjustable expansion band
retailing for 59.95"
So this is a 67 Date King TT. Glad to have a name to a face :) Happy research guys!
Taaa daaaaa!
Information which would all but put to rest the theory that the Bulova 'PRESIDENT' came with anything less than 30 Jewels in 1964.
Comon sense says Movement Jewel counts do not change within a specific Model within a given production Year.
Nice one Marty.
Thank you Simple.
I have two questions for all of you.
1) The service department says that it has an 'unbreakable' mainspring. Unbreakable to me is a myth, anything can break. Do they claim that the watchspring is unbreakable if there is some sort of part int the movement that will prevent you from overwinding the mainspring? Does that safety feature make a mainspring 'unbreakable'?
2) Now that I am talking to a Bulova Service employee, should I ask for them to consider becoming a part of this forum? I am not trying to become an ambassador between us and Bulova, I just have an open line with them at the moment and while I have their attention should I bring this up to see if they can come in and provide: a) more ads b)catalogs they can provide c) a definitive answer as to yes this a Date King TT and not a stainless steel President. It was just a thought. Although I find that most of you are very informative and well versed in all things Bulova and I respect all of your hardwork, I ask this becuase then Bulova themselves can come in and clear up loose ends and end small debates as to whether the red ad was indeed a misprint or is correct.
I leave this all to you our respected panel members, and Administrators, I would just love to see this website flourish into what I know it can become at its full potential. If this comes off as offensive, I apologize, that is not my intention. I would just like to suggest idea's that can help us out.
Marty
In reply to Thank you Simple. I have by Marty0341